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Twitter has publicly launched their discord and theres ton of people joining it right now cause it was just boosted by Jack. I got them to set up a channel and many folks are there discussing the fediverse in relation to the future of twitter. I think its important to make our voices heard there, whatever they may be. Right now there are way too many crypto people trying to push that direction. Come along for a ride!

discord.com/invite/YmrHBhCuFa

Golda, one of the main organizers of just made this comment that implies a decision has been made somewhere that Bluesky is not going to be built as a blockchain project, but might still support crypto transactions which makes sense to me

Just discovered the new Twitter project lead Jay Graber is already on the fediverse at @arcalinea

@liaizon I'm a little concerned that their only rule is "No member of the community shall take unfair advantage of any other member of the community".

I sense this is going to be a poorly-moderated hellscape, but I will give them the benefit of the doubt to begin with.

@TrechNex yes it seems it will definitely become a hellscape. but its currently not toooo overrun

@TrechNex @liaizon BlueSky had job postings for "Protocol Developer" and "Web Developer"

I think they should probably have hired at least 1 "Moderator" before letting the dogs out on discord :blobtonguewink:

@msh @TrechNex there are a number of people who are Mods so far but I haven't seen them do too much conversation steering

@TrechNex @liaizon also the irony of "we're going to build a decentralized service where anyone has the freedom to run their own server or write their own client. hm; where shall we discuss this? oh, I know; how about the proprietary chat service whose TOS state that they will delete your account if you use anything but the official spyware client; that's perfect"

very strong "how do you do fellow kids" energy

@technomancy @liaizon in their defence, they did listen to people pointing this out to them.

I think they're bridging to bsky-fediverse:matrix.org

(There may be more channels under +bluesky-community:matrix.org)

@liaizon wait, are you saying fediverse people might want to have a stance on Twitter/Bluesky other than "oh god no; stay away from me"?

@liaizon it honestly never even crossed my mind that anything good could come from Bluesky succeeding.

OTOH if Bluesky fails spectacularly, that's great; it draws attention to the idea of federated networks, shows people that Twitter doesn't have to be the only way, and many of the people who would have used Bluesky end up checking out the fediverse and getting the benefits of decentralization without bringing the Curse of the Brands with them or having to reinvent everything from scratch.

@technomancy I don't disagree with that being a probable direction this could take. But seeing how this develops it will surely have *some* impact and I think people here have a valid reason to try to push this towards using more open standards then not. Its looking most likely to me that twitter is thinking of activitypub+crypto mushed together as the path

@liaizon maybe you can unpack some of that; I still don't follow.

are you saying that it's possible the money that Twitter would spend in activitypub-adjacent tooling could somehow be greater than the amount of damage the brands and advertising they intend bring with them would have on the activitypub ecosystem?

that seems ... vanishingly unlikely to me?

@technomancy I’m saying that they are gonna do something regardless. And they are looking for contributing ideas to help direct them. This so far seems like a weird hybrid where Twitter is finding a research project. I think there are good and bad things that will come out of this regardless of the direction the project takes.

@liaizon the only honest outcome that such a research group could come up with is "wups; turns out healthy social media has been incompatible with capitalism all along" and as soon as they say that, the funding is gone. is there any way for the research group to survive without producing disingenuous results?

@liaizon @technomancy maybe useful things we can steal, and we can try to influence things in that direction :p

@KitRedgrave @liaizon @technomancy tbh I think I'm only going to engage for a few days before I toddle off again. 😅

Hopefully better minds than my own with more time will be able to make a difference.

@liaizon Walking into this crypto techbro lion's den won't be for the faint hearted but someone will have to do it.

Are any of them at least clued in enough to understand that community safety/moderation is essential for the social web to succeed and it is "good for business" to have that established before even trying to codify standards for monetisation? Like, even the shrewdest business person *must* realise that some wild west censorship-resistent blockchain free-for-all is only going to capture the fringes of society and scare away the "average consumer".

Or have they mostly got frozen peaches for brains?

@˗ˏˋ wakest ˎˊ˗ A federated project discussing how to federate on a non-federated platform - great 😅

@˗ˏˋ wakest ˎˊ˗ Yeah most things are these days. Still, seems weird to choose a centralized platform 🤔

@liaizon

I have no wish to contribute. I'd be making the most perfectly serious and well-thought-out comments of my life … and the crypto people would be convinced I'm trolling them for LoLs.

@liaizon The crypto people will win. Jack said a while ago that if he wasn't doing what he's doing then he would be working on cryptocurrencies.

If BlueSky isn't just a boondoggle then becoming a hellish cryptosite would be a useful outcome because I think it would destroy Twitter. The field then opens up for other possibilities.

@neauoire @liaizon I get the annoyance with moderation policies on m.s and all that, but instance-shaming particular people is, I feel, unnecessary.

A month ago my main alt was also on m.s.

@rysiek @liaizon Well, beyond instance shaming. If your goal is to study decentralization in federated space, and you choose the most centralized instance to do that study, I'd say that you're probably having a skewed perspective of what the fediverse is all about.

@neauoire @rysiek granted if you are coming here from Twitter you may not know that at all. I was on mastodon.social for my first few years here though it was about the only instance of mastodon when I started

@neauoire @liaizon that assumes that the person in question does not have alts on other instances

@neauoire @rysiek @liaizon she already has a skewed perspective if she thinks people wanna be called "content creators" or want anything to do with cryptocurrency or monetization.

It sounds like they aren't interested in federation but 'inventing federation'. It's not clear if they will allow fediverse clients to federate with their proprietary federation.
actually I'd bet it will be like "sign up for the Twitter Federation Developer Program" where you submit your "app" and get approved/denied, then an API key and then you can "federate" with twitter.
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